With things being so sparsely populated up there, would there REALLY be an impetus to have some sort of larger government? Louisiannan
I don't know if the Athabascan government started out all that large, but the income resulting from the second largest oil deposits in the world could have stabilized the region in a hurry.
Yankovic270 17:37, April 30, 2010 (UTC)
- Who is buying the oil? Mitro 17:48, April 30, 2010 (UTC)
- Mitro has a point, Yank. Athabasca can't both be isolationist and rich from selling oil. Until there is a working pipeline to existing and prosperous nations, there is no market. Without refineries, the oil they do get from the ground is next to useless in running their existing machinery. They need to build an infastructure, and for that they need investors. I am sure that Superior, Victoria, and "official" Canada would be most interested. Assinobia, with its border disputes down south, probably is still not ready or able to be trading in crude oil.
- By the way, in OTL all that oil is locked up in the soil and very expensive to process. SouthWriter 13:03, May 1, 2010 (UTC)
- I've noticed a curious trend with these articles you've made. They all seem to be interconnected in one way or another your getting arms from this mysterious "Virginia Republic" (not to mention thats pretty damn implausible) and their best friends with the Assiniboians. They also seem unabashedly isolationist like Virginia, Lincoln and Assiniboia. Now why in heavens name is that? Also I agree with South theres no what they can be both rich and isolationist. I would think that these people if they are as "pragmatic" as you say they are would have joined the western provisional Canada or at least the NAU. --GOPZACK 15:54, May 1, 2010 (UTC)
- Not to say "Do it my way, me me me", but since Yukon was recently accepted and has a similar climate to Athabaska, it might be useful as a model. People in such a sparsely populated area have different needs from densely settled, civilized areas. In the absense of modern social services, there's little need for much government to speak of. The Yukon's basically a confederation of subsistence villages and some semi-nomadic communities. It exists to arbitrate their differences and maintain some semblance of order. Beyond that, there's little it can do, and little reason to have a nation at all, much less a nation that people feel nationalistic about. Benkarnell 16:35, May 1, 2010 (UTC)
Dang, I was too late. I was going to do a small confederation of city states in the Peace River area of BC and Alberta. Which by the way would make more sense than annexing the extremely sparsely populated northern Saskatchewan, which likely is nearly ready to rejoin the rest of Saskatchewan. Also, The oil sands were too expensive to develop until the price of oil reached over $60 a barrel. With this world economy and every little nation-state miraculously finding oil the price of oil would be more like 15-20 dollars a barrell. I think it more likely that if they are relying on international trade, food exports would be their major trade good. I also think that as an overall trend on this timeline we have an overabundance of nationalism for young states. 5 years after Doomsday a fresh young independent state when encountering legitimate remnants of its former nation would jump at the chance at rejoining, unless you have a situation like Saguenay, where there was a history of strong separatist sentiment.Oerwinde 08:31, May 7, 2010 (UTC)
How do you like it now? I changed it into a loose confederation of city-states that are mostly funded economically by grain sales. The oil, if any, would probbabbly be used to fuel the farming equipment of their farmers. Is it more plausible now?
Yankovic270 01:39, May 17, 2010 (UTC)
Thats more plausible, but I still think they wouldn't be against joining the Saskatoon government. Possibly as a 3rd province in order to maintain a level of Autonomy. Just because they're "doing fine on their own" doesn't mean they wouldn't rejoin their former nation, which would bring many benefits.Oerwinde 21:13, May 22, 2010 (UTC)
What if they are just starting negotiations to join either the Provisional Canada or the NAU?
Yankovic270 14:46, May 24, 2010 (UTC)
My guess is that they would join the Provisional Canada which would then subsequently make them a part of the NAU. GOPZACK 17:28, May 24, 2010 (UTC)
I am in agreement with GOPZACK on this issue. Joining the NAU would bring many benefits to Athabaska.HAD 18:12, May 24, 2010 (UTC)
Thank you for the kind words HAD. Quite frankly I would have thought these "pragmatic" Athabaskan would have joined the Provisional Canada by now. GOPZACK 18:39, May 24, 2010 (UTC)
Alberta is basically Canada's Texas, which means that they are an intensely proud people. This may be why they have refrained from joining Provisional Canada/NAU until now.
Yankovic270 18:58, May 24, 2010 (UTC)
Well Alberta between Calgary and Edmonton has been particularly lawless and only started making strides after the restoration of Red Deer. Its possible with the remote location of the Peaceland and the lawlessness of central alberta that Athabaska hasn't really had much contact with Provisional Canada until recently. The restoration of Red Deer could also be the event that gives the Athabaskan people faith in the Provisional government leading to their desire for reunification.Oerwinde 19:09, May 24, 2010 (UTC)
I really doubt that the Athabaskans are going to join the Provisional Canada, especially now that they know that it isn't the "true" sucessor to the Canadian government. Besides, the years of isolation have made them establish their own national identity. They may not be isolationist, but they still mostly keep to themselves.
Yankovic270 16:06, May 25, 2010 (UTC)
You don't build a national identity in such a short time. For the first few years the populace would consider themselves Canadian. Then when contact is made with Canada, this feeling would get more intense. They would get a sense of national pride that their nation survived such a catastrophe. Once the realization that the government is unable to help comes along then you'll have some disappointment and despair, then the younger generation will begin to think of forging their own future, but won't be in any position to do anything, and will be heavily influenced by their parents and grandparents speaking highly of Canada. At this point you probably have about 25% of the people in power being the younger generation, and of that maybe 50% believe they should go it alone. We have far too much nationalism for states that didn't exist in any form before Doomsday. The majority of Athabaskans would consider themselves Canadian. Provisional Canada is a Canadian government of the west with goals of reunification once infrastructure is rebuilt. This is likely something the Athabaskans would desire. On the other hand, there could be enough of a regional identity that they no longer consider themselves Albertan.Oerwinde 17:08, May 25, 2010 (UTC)
Have you heard of an enclave or exclave? 
File:AlbertaEnsign.png File:AustraliaFlag.png OreoToast555(Talk) 23:38, July 6, 2013 (UTC)
Yeah, enclave is a nation completely surrounded by another nation, such as Lesotho, an exclave is a part of a nation separated from its motherland by another nation, such as Kaliningrad or Cabinda. Theres a little more to it than that, but for practical purposes thats about it. Why?Oerwinde (talk) 03:43, July 7, 2013 (UTC)
Population/Area[]
So, the current land area of 875,832 km2 is too high. Thats like 200 km2 more than the entire area of Alberta. Also, the population is way too high. The entirety of the Northern Alberta region has a modern day population of 350,000. Without the influx of immigration of the last 20 years or so OTL that would be much lower, plus standard population stagnation/reduction due to lack of medicine and amenities, raiders, emmigration, etc. I'd say the population would be more around 80-100k.Oerwinde (talk) 04:19, July 7, 2013 (UTC)
You miss, however, that there would be refugees added, and that the region has, migrants aside, had a net loss of people. The locals have a high tendency to leave. Population still off, but not by that large a margin. Lordganon (talk) 07:57, July 10, 2013 (UTC)
Oerwinde, that's over 200, 000 km2 more than all of Alberta. Alberta's total area is 661, 848 km2.
CRPofVancouver (talk) 22:00, October 28, 2013 (UTC)
Local Knowledge/Updates[]
Hello!
If you go through the history of this article, I declared some time ago that I live in this region and have something of some knowledge about the area. This is still the case and I would be more than happy to contribute to this article, perhaps updating it to 2016 standards.
I think some things should be changed in this article:
The Consul of Athabasca, shown here to be Dwight Logan, who in OTL was the Mayor of Grande Prairie up until a few years ago is no longer mayor. I've drawn the conclusion that Consul = Mayor and that it might be in the best interest of updating this article to change the portrait to the current mayor of Grande Prairie, Bill Given.
The Athabasca Oil Sands. The map on this ATL's home page shows the oil sands to be out of Athabasca's control and under control of the Northwest Alliance, while the article almost parades around the idea of Athabasca benefitting from controlling the Athabasca oil sands. I would like to see the map updated to show the oil sands under the control of Athabasca.
I would also like to really expand on this article, and I intend to if there isn't any dialog soon. It seems that 1983: Doomsday is essentially dead in the water, with the last WCRB Article being published in October of 2015. It's currently April 2016. I'll allow for a couple of weeks to see if anything happens in this talk page before I go to work on this article.
Thanks in advance!
OreoToast555(Talk)(Sandbox) 19:33, April 7, 2016 (UTC)